Travel down the nested worlds

[davidn]

When not flying around in space with a railgun recently, I've also been playing the original Etrian Odyssey after receiving the least convincing pirate copy of it ever for Christmas. Fortunately it works and saves correctly (with the added bonus that I could get an adaptor and back up my save file, should I ever need to), and so I've mapped and fought my way down to the second stratum.

Going backwards through a series is an odd experience sometimes, as the refinements that the games made over time appear to be discarded, exposing rougher edges. The most obvious ones here are the insane (or possibly just vindictive) omission of arrows from the available map icons, the slower pace of the battle system, and that the process of going around the town isn't very streamlined, with separate categories for sleeping until morning and night and having to get medicine and healing in a different place from all other items. Otherwise, it's been more of the same gradual mission and reward system that I loved when I first started the third game.

Unlike the last time when I basically chose my party by closing my eyes, spinning around, jabbing a finger forward and seeing whose colossal bosom it impacted first, I had something approaching an idea of what I was likely to need this time, and tried to adhere to the tradition I had accidentally started of reversing the roles of most other role-playing games, having the women as the stronger fighting characters and the men as the weaker support ones. I'm even more progressive than a fourteen-minute Dream Theater solo.

Etrian Odyssey parties gradually change over time as you find gaps you have to fill, but the first Monk character that I made in the third game had the good fortune to stay around through all those changes, becoming a vital cornerstone of the group - as everyone needs a healer. So this time, I went straight for the Medic class, the character that was at the centre of kjorteo's story of betrayal, knowing that this was his chance to play the most vital role in the party and I would never have any reason to replace him. Then I decided that I actually liked the other portrait better and therefore ditched him immediately. That character really does have the most incredible bad luck.

Tamara, then, took over as de facto leader of the party by being the longest-serving member by a clear couple of minutes. Her description says she's a Landsknecht, a role which involves standing in the front row, cutting things up with a sword, and knowing what a Landsknecht is.

One of the things that make Etrian Odyssey games such a unique experience to each player is that there aren't enough skill points to go around even within one class - one player's fighter can be very different from another's. Landsknechte have a choice between swords and axes, one of which seems to be suitable for very powerful hits on one character and one for attacks that are more spread across enemies. I've gone for the latter for now, and it makes clearing out larger parties of enemies a very quick process indeed.

Amy is a Dark Hunter, a class which I'm pretty sure Atlus wanted to name Dominatrix - they fight with a whip, with available techniques including "Shackles", "Cuffs", "Ecstasy" and "Climax". In the third game, I felt myself very lacking in the ability to bind enemies - these games' equivalent of Silence, where binds prevent moves that require use of the arms, legs or head separately - and so she seemed like a good character to take along to experiment. She's primarily been used as a straight attacker so far, but I've no doubt the ability to prevent stronger enemies from performing more devastating moves will be a refreshing change from continually trying to patch up their effects.

One of the classes that I originally tried in Etrian Odyssey 3 was a Zodiac, a character who primarily used magic instead of physical attacks. Unfortunately he was replaced very quickly due to my realizing that I had too many back-row characters, and because his total available magic points at that stage of the game left him uselessly whacking people with his stick after only about two rounds' worth of setting things on fire. This time, though, Zothen is being given a proper chance to take his place in the party - and he's already proved incredibly useful, having by far the most powerful attack in the early game particularly when he uses the right spell against an otherwise impenetrable enemy's elemental weakness.

Siegfried returns to my party from Etrian Odyssey 3, except this time with a shorter hairstyle and an unfeasibly large mouth. Some years off becoming a prince yet but with much the same shiny armour, in this game he's a Protector, a class with the ability to draw attacks away from the rest of the party and to absorb it themselves. Or he would if I ever bothered to use any of that - much like Amy, he's also proving very capable as an attacker while I hack my way through the game to the bits where non-attack techniques will eventually come in useful.

And finally, Apollo Justice. This spiky-haired junior is the medic of the group, and so doesn't do any damage to speak of at all, but I rely on him to keep people's health up during long explorations. The ability to revive knocked-out party members, however, seems to be quite far off in this game - rather than spending massive amounts of skill points or using up the worryingly rare Nectar items, it's more usual for me to warp back to the town and throw them on to a slab for more serious injuries to be looked at by Dr Hoffman.

 

And they've all been very capable so far. Having learned not to overstretch myself by the sheer speed of my first demise in the third game, everyone was able to stay mostly alive throughout the first tentative steps into the dungeon (apart from Amy, who's a bit soft). I even managed to survive my first encounter with the much-dreaded Ragelopes, the first ever FOE in the game on the second floor - though they're not exactly easy, and the first boss Fenrir and his seven hundred minion-wolves reminded me exactly what the series was known for.

Now I'm gradually exploring the top floor of the second stratum, with the blessing of a small safe point quite nearby - which is a comfort especially now that I actually have to remember to buy Warp Wires in order to be able to return to the town quickly. After having forgotten twice in a row, I've taken to stocking up two or three just in case.

Comments

[dr-dos.livejournal.com]

I wanted to enjoy this game, but I just couldn't. I played every night at my old job on breaks for about 2 weeks straight and never made it beyond the 2nd floor. Leveling is so slow and a good week of that was spent just so I could beat the first special wandering monster thing, only tofind the level had at least 2 more of them, and I'm pretty sure they respawned every time you left the dungeon.

Double the experience gains and maybe I'd have been able to get into it because I still want a simple develop your party and delve into a way too deep dungeon game (although now I'd prefer it being a PC game rather than DS)

[davidn]

I'll write one myself, then :)

The wandering FOEs are meant to be madly overpowered for the stage you encounter them in the game, to discourage you from doing exactly that - I can't remember the exact wording of the message you get when you first see them in EO1, but certainly in EO3 they try to condition you that getting into a fight with one might as well be instant death, rather than something to be beaten at that moment. (They come back a week after you defeat them in game time.)

It's worth mentioning that I definitely found the levelling here slower than in later games in the series, too... particularly at the very start when you're literally getting 1 to 3 experience points per character per fight.

[kjorteo]

EO3's obligatory "this is an FOE, if you fight it you will die" warning sequence was actually a little annoying to me on my second runthrough, since Kujura still looked at my team as though we were barely out of diapers, gave his whole speech about how just because I beat the first floor doesn't mean I should get cocky and that monster over there will slaughter me, etc. Then I killed it in two hits and Kujura had already left so he didn't see >:(

[xaq.livejournal.com]

And of course, no mention of the Fnarking Overpowered Enemy (F.O.E.) can be made without bringing this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiYuZP-HB7I) up.

[davidn]

Yes, that's a much better name for them... I had to look up what the first game had called them, "Foedus Obrepit Errabundus" - which is Latin for "Six hours with a phrase book and this is the best we could do".

[xaq.livejournal.com]

Oh, I thought it was supposed to actually mean "Field-Observable Enemy," seeing as you could...well...see them on the field.

Still, my original suggestion fits them perfectly, it seems.

[kjorteo]

It's Field-On Enemy in Japan. For whatever reason, they changed it to to Formido Oppugnatura Exsequens ("nature's ancient and terrible warriors") in America.

They claim that Foedus Obrepit Errabundus ("the vile, wandering one sneaks up") is just the name of their theme song and that's what causes the confusion, though I'm not 100% sure that's true. Who knows....

[davidn]

"Foedus Obrepit Errabundus" doesn't have anywhere near enough words in its title to be an Etrian Odyssey song name!

[kjorteo]

Oh, I keep forgetting to correct this--FOEs respawning in 7 days and bosses in 14 is actually a change they made for EO2 and 3. It used to be (that is, it suddenly is for you now since you went back to EO1) 3 and 11. (Hence the "Every 3 days it's FOE!" line from the IOSYS song.)

[davidn]

I keep getting more and more glad that I started the series with the third game... it sounds like due to a combination of finding a better difficulty curve and just rounding off the corners of the interface later on in the series, the first game now plays almost like a version of the game I know for more advanced players - enduring the same type of quest with higher base item prices, five floors per stratum instead of four, far fewer healing options and having icons you're used to being "taken away" from the map, faster-reviving FOEs... and, as I've just discovered, introducing absolutely vicious 7-damage tiles within two floors of the second stratum.

I should say, though, that after the slow start I'm actually finding myself levelling this new party up a lot faster than I did in Etrian Odyssey 3. It could well be that I'm just used to having to gather seventy thousand experience points to get anyone to advance through the unlocked 70+ super-levels, though.

[kjorteo]

You just mistook Etrian Odyssey for other RPGs (particularly Squaresoft ones) where "you sense the presence of a dreadful and much-too-powerful monster up ahead, beware" just means "save first if you're underleveled, otherwise eh." In EO, when they tell you that that thing over there will totally eat your face and your only hope is to not fight it, they mean it.

I found the leveling pace in all three games to be just fine, but I take an extremely cautious exploration style where I have to map out absolutely 100% of a floor before moving on (even if I find the stairs early, I just draw in where the stairs are and then ignore them until I have the rest of the floor complete) and I take absolutely every excuse (made any amount of progress, unlocked a shortcut, characters are just low on MP) to warp out and sleep at the inn and save. Pair that with my longstanding rule against ever running from battles (I wasn't even aware you could flee from FOEs in EO3 until the bonus dungeon) so I'm usually fine just because of all the grinding I accidentally did just in the course of entering every floor like eight times each.

[dr-dos.livejournal.com]

Unless I was being really dumb, there was no way to avoid it. Well, I suppose running would have worked, but then every time I went into the dungeon I'd have to hope I can run away rather than being nearly one-shotted by whatever it was.

[kjorteo]

Probably the former. The Ragelopes (and I think Kuyuthas too but I could be wrong) on floor 2 have extremely straightforward patrols (walk forward until you hit the wall, turn around, walk forward until you hit the other wall, repeat) and don't aggro you at all. Getting past them is just a matter of not bumping into them, which itself is just a matter of timing. The important thing is to not get in a random encounter while in the middle of their route (thus freezing you there long enough for the Ragelope to come back and get you) but that's why you have that "how close am I to getting in a random encounter" radar.

The Stalkers on floor 3 have an interesting pattern of (if memory serves) aggroing and coming straight for you for two steps (with a heavy, heavy preference for sidestepping instead of advancing if you're even slightly diagonal to it, just to establish a "you shall not pass" line and make it harder to circle it) and then completely freezing and giving you a free unanswered move for the third step, then repeating. They then drop those things in giant open rooms, and the whole point is puzzling out the correct path to get around them based on their movement rules.

FOEs are the absolute epitome of "you can't beat this thing yet, come back later." Hell, Stalkers have a conditional drop for beating them in three turns or less. Good luck even beating them at all until like six floors later at least, and beating them that quickly is an achievement for near the end of the game.

[davidn]

Coming at this from Etrian Odyssey 3, the Stalkers terrified the life out of me - this wasn't only a FOE, this was a fifth stratum superenemy that was suddenly after me! And they even move reacting to your movements, which doesn't happen until much later in the third game - getting into a fight with one and getting hit by it didn't do anything to change this fearful reaction.

[kjorteo]

Aw, but they love you! They're just cute Pokemon that want to give you ... wait, wrong blade-armed mantis monster with a seven-letter name beginning with S- and ending with -ER.